Discussion in 'Fiesta ST Maintenance' started by LuvfiestaST, May 2, 2014.

  1. mkeperson

    mkeperson Member

    There are very few paints that can withstand the heat of brake calipers. There is a whole field of "high temperature coatings", if you care to learn more. Many of the old 'paints' that could withstand exhaust manifold level temperatures are long gone for environmental reasons. If you want to do it yourself you need to do a fair amount of research and be prepared for some expense.
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  3. WScottCross

    WScottCross Well-Known Member

    I agree that track time is harder on the brakes, just trying to see if what you used was designed for use on the calipers. Sorry to hear about your discolored calipers. What do you think you'll do about it? Try again with something else?
  4. IIRC, brakes work best after the pad friction material has transferred to the rotor. One of the reasons cast iron makes decent rotor material is because it is somewhat porous and picks up some friction material from the pads. What you don't want is the resin used to hold the friction material together on the pad building up on the rotor (glazing). I believe glazing usually occurs from improper bedding of the pads and /or riding the brakes lightly as you drive.
    There are other problems caused by a combination of driving styles and cheap (also called light weight, mileage boosting, oem) rotors, hardspotting.
  5. jimclark

    jimclark Active Member

    For now, anyway, I'm going with the look as a badge of honor sort of thing. Since I don't plan on too many track days, I will likely repaint at some point in the future. I forgot to mention before that the paint had withstood a couple autocross events without difficulty.
  6. How bout Cerakoat? Not a lot of bright colors but seems to be pretty tough stuff.

  7. mkeperson

    mkeperson Member

    If you look at the Cerakote literature they only achieved surface temperatures of 250F. The coatings I refer to usually work in the range of 900-2000F. VHT makes paints, including a line specifically for calibers, that provides temp protection to 900F. Other vendors include Rustoleum (High Heat Auto Paint), and Superior Industries (Zithron 900). These products are not inexpensive ($18 per spray can & up). Please read the fine print for all these products: some require special primers, some require temperature curing in ovens, etc. There was a reason I ponied up the money for factory painted calibers. Yes, I could do it myself but I knew all the work involved to be happy with DIY results.
  8. Sorry, I guess I just took that to mean that the coating was not an efficient radiator of heat but that it could withstand the 900+ deg. F of input heat.
    I believe Cerakote makes the coating that MRT is using on some of their exhaust tips.
    The last time I investigated Cerakote most of their coatings did need to be baked on. It's been a while.
    I wonder if you could Jet Hot them to good effect. I thought they had a coating that claimed to be a radiation promoting finish.
  9. Driver45

    Driver45 Member

    I am having the grinding issue now. It used to grind a little when I would come to a stop, but it has migrated to a louder and a "something seems wrong" sound. I originally thought it was just the cold weather, as they were squealling a little when I would stop. However, that sound seemed to die off after a few stops or a quicker stop. But, then it persisted into a grinding noise. I took it into the dealership tonight to see if they could figure it out, as 2000 miles ago I had it in for an oil change and they said my pads were in the green zone and there was no way they could already be warn down (it sounds like worn off pads on the disks, for your reference). The mechanics took it and established that it indeed had more than enough brake pad material left (10mm in the front and 8mm in the rear - I have 8800 miles on the car). They also inspected the disks and nothing seemed wrong to them, despite the squealling they could hear from the front and the grinding in the rear. Unfortunately, they took it over night to dig into it more tomorrow, since they still had no idea what is causing the sounds. I will update after they hopefully solve / determine the cause tomorrow. In the meantime I am stuck with a POS loaner Fusion (last gen=superPOS).

    Please advise if you have dealt with this, or know what is going on. @Gremzor - did you ever get your issue solved?
  10. FORZDA 2

    FORZDA 2 Member

    The issue is likely caused by overnight surface rust on the rotors and the aggressive brake pads the are standard on the ST (front and rear). It is a "normal" sound. The "mechanics" likely "aren't". If you want it to go away quicker, just drag the hand brake for a few feet.
  11. Gremzor

    Gremzor New Member

    Never got it solved : (. It has actually become louder in the last week or two, again. I have been considering taking it back in. The grinding is persistent, it might quiet down a little bit after a few stops, but still stays loud enough to be concerning.
  12. Ca5p3r

    Ca5p3r Member

    I seem to have this squealing sounds also. It reminds me of my neon after I put a few thousand miles on my Hawk HP+ pads. I think the sound is just a result of an aggressive set of pads.

    also, it only squeals worth a certain range of brake pressure. To little or to much and no squeal.
  13. RDgolfer

    RDgolfer Active Member

    Did you break in your brakes btw? I have grindy sounds at full lock and at other the brakes work!
  14. Driver45

    Driver45 Member

    So my car had to spend another night at the dealer since they decided to order a new set of front pads. Apparently no one in the area has the pads in stock and they have to be overnighted from Nashville,TN. They claim they were pitted (bad material). Sounds like a manufacturing defect possibly. The rears may possibly be warped so they resurfaced them and hopefully that solved the grinding issue. Idk how they would have gotten warped already (8800 miles of street use and no track time?). I will be asking more tomorrow when I pick it up.

    @RDgolfer - What needs to be broken in? How?
    Neely2005 likes this.
  15. RDgolfer

    RDgolfer Active Member

    Instructions for bedding in it
  16. Dyn085

    Dyn085 Active Member

    Bedding your brakes involves doing 6-10 near-emergency stops from 60 mph. You want to brake as hard as you can without engaging the ABS and you don't want to completely stop the car. Take it down to about 10-20 mph then immediately get off the brakes and accelerate up to speed for the next braking session.

    Your stops will get progressively longer and you'll start to notice brake-fade, but that's to be expected. Upon completion of your final near-stop you want to try and cruise for 10-15 minutes or so with as little (preferably none) braking as possible to cool everything back down. After that you're done, unless you feel like doing it a second time. If you intend on doing it a second time you need to allow the brakes time to completely cool from the first time.

    If done properly your discs will all have a blue hue to them from the heat generated/transferred. Don't go faster than 60 mph before braking as the additional heat can lead to melted pads.
  17. Ca5p3r

    Ca5p3r Member

    i dont think i bedded the brakes on my FiST. I got her with 130 miles so.. If I were to, then I wouldn't be following the break-in process for the car (which I didn't follow anyways).

    I did bed the brakes on my neon though... Or maybe I thought I did, but it wasn't proper. -_-
  18. Dyn085

    Dyn085 Active Member

    If you follow the procedure as outlined above then it shouldn't affect your engine break-in procedure. You don't want to race up to speed because you're trying to gradually build heat into the rotors/pads-not cook and melt them, so just accelerate normally. Basically you're building a lot of heat, cooling it to a temperature slightly higher than before your braking, building a lot of heat, cooling it, et cetera. Besides tempering the rotors it is also allowing the pad to transfer material.

    There are a couple of things I didn't mention or expound upon. The first is that you're going to smell some burning and see some smoke-that's normal and doesn't mean your pads are melting off. Secondly (actually lastly, in terms of the process), if at all possible you want to park your car without the parking brake on for the final cooling. I go as far as avoiding having my foot on the brakes at stoplights on the drive home (or in daily driving if I'm to be honest) whenever possible. Also, it is possible to need to re-bed the brakes if you wear off the transfer material over time. Finally, this is a general process that works well with most OEM pads/rotors-if you upgrade pads/rotors or install a BBK then you'll want to follow whatever bed-in process is recommended by the manufacturer.

    Note: Being stopped at stop lights/signs without brakes applied is dangerous, so be situationally aware if you go that route. Getting rear-ended is a bad situation no matter what, but getting t-boned immediately after because you shot out into cross-traffic would be even worse.
  19. Driver45

    Driver45 Member

    Update on my brake issue:

    Sorry for the severe delay...However, after taking it to the dealer I was told the front pads were pitted and the rear rotors were possibly warped. They could not explain the issue other than that, nor what caused it. The mechanics told me they heard squealing from the front brakes and grinding out back. They replaced the front pads and machined both sets of disks for me free of charge. Immediately afterwards I bedded the brakes by getting to 60 mph and emergency braking without engaging the ABS and releasing the brakes at about 15-20 mph. I repeated this about 10 times. I highly recommend you find the right spot to do this, as I am sure you look dumb while you do it and attract a bit of attention if you are not in a quiet, traffic-less spot. I parked the car for a bit to cool down without brakes engaged. I checked all four disks for the blue-ish tint, which is the tell tale sign of doing it correctly. I do not have the grinding issue anymore. I do notice a difference in the braking potential and as a bonus the brakes seem to dust a bit less. I have always been careful about sitting on the brakes while stopped at traffic lights, but I have never had a car that needs the brakes bedded from the factory like this one.

    After going through all of this, I would HIGHLY recommend that you bed the OEM brakes! If you do not, I could bet that you will most likely get the "glazing" type issue that I saw. You will not ruin the car without bedding the brakes, but you will brake better, have less dust, and probably go through brakes more quickly.
    Neely2005, XR650R and Dyn085 like this.
  20. BlackBird

    BlackBird Active Member Staff Member

    Congratulations on your Brownbo brake kit upgrade! (This happened regularly to the gold-painted Brembos on certain-years of WRX STis, leading to the nickname).
  21. johnnyquest

    johnnyquest Member

    I started having the same problem with my car recently. I took it to the local dealer in New York (the same dealer who told me they can not install tires my size because they are too low profile) and they told me my rear brakes were warped. They resurfaced the disks under warranty, but I will hear the grinding sound. It's at it's worst when I first pull away in the morning and subsides after the brakes warm up. I think it's a combination of the cold temperatures and moisture. I was concerned it was the salt/de-ice solution that was eating my brakes, and I'm also concerned because the noise seems to be coming from the rears only. Could also have something to do with the parking brake being used, that the pads don't get a chance to dry out because they are squeezed against the rotor when the parking brake is set. I'm going to try parking the car at night in first gear without the parking brake to see if there's a difference.

    Neely2005 likes this.

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