Larger rear sway bar?

Discussion in 'Fiesta ST Autocross' started by AlanBDahl, Feb 7, 2014.

  1. AlanBDahl

    AlanBDahl Active Member

    I'm not ready to start throwing changes at my car yet as I haven't raced it yet but I'm thinking a slightly larger and perhaps adjustable rear sway bar might be interesting. What options, if any, are there?
     
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  3. marc89gti

    marc89gti Active Member

    As far as I know the FiST doesn't have a rear sway bar (correct me if I'm wrong), it has a rear twist beam. I think because of the stiffness of the rear twist beam Ford figured a rear sway bar isn't necessary. I think the rear twist beam is 70% stiffer than a base Fiesta.
     
  4. AlanBDahl

    AlanBDahl Active Member

    If that's the case then adding a stock rear bar might be an interesting experiment. I'll have to take a look at a non-ST Fiesta for comparison.
     
  5. eRic

    eRic Active Member

    there is no rear sway bar on the Fiesta [or Fiesta ST]. The Fiesta ST rear torsion beam is 70% stiffer. I tried a Racing Beat rear bar on my 2011 Fiesta and it was REALLY effective but too much for the non-defeatable ESC to handle. my 2011 Fiesta would be on three wheels through slaloms with the ESC light blinking away. I removed it and got a CorkSport rear torsion bar that did not hoist the rear tire nearly as high off the ground so the ESC didn't freak out so much. Both are sold as Mazda2 parts but they fit the Fiesta. I have not had an opportunity to autocross my Fiesta ST yet so I don't know if it needs more rear bar or not.

    here's a link to my adventures on fiestafaction
    http://www.fiestafaction.com/forums/fiesta-suspension/33871-racing-beat-rear-sway-bar.html#post75152
    http://www.fiestafaction.com/forums...r-torsion-bar-vs-sway-bar-etc.html#post156117

    http://www.racingbeat.com/Mazda-2/Sway-Bars/77101.html
    http://www.corksport.com/corksport-mazda-2-torsion-bar.html
     
    Last edited: Feb 7, 2014
  6. Zormecteon

    Zormecteon Active Member

    If a car over steers you add a front sway bar, if it under steers you use a rear one. Since the FiST is just about neutral, you would probably be making problems, not solving them. It already stays just about flat in a corner.
     
  7. D1JL

    D1JL Well-Known Member

    I have both the front and rear from Eibach on my car.
    I was very happy with the way the car handeled untill I took it to the race track last week.
    Now I am ecstatic.


    Dave
     
    Last edited: Feb 11, 2014
  8. wash

    wash Active Member

    Balancing roll stiffness front to back is important.

    A good thing to remember is that the ST has a smaller front bar than the base Fiesta.

    I think total front roll stiffness is similar because the ST has higher spring rates which also contribute to roll stiffness.

    If we do things to increase the rear roll stiffness, we need to match it in the front to retain the same handling balance so I think the base Fiesta front bar is going to be a good speed part for people who add a rear bar.

    The Eibach front bar is so much bigger that I worry it may not be possible to match the rear roll stiffness.

    Hopefully D1JL and others can speak to that.
     
  9. D1JL

    D1JL Well-Known Member

    That of course gives you another option.
    You could put a non ST front bar in (I still have the one from my '11 that I could use).

    As I said, I am very happy with the way my car is set up now.
    It worked extremely well on the Streets of Willow last week.
    You can look at the photos posted in the road race section and see the body roll difference between McRib's and my car.

    We are going to do the Big Track at Willow next weekend.
    This being a more high speed track it should give me a more well rounded picture of handling.

    So let me do this next track day before I make further comments.

    Come on down wash.
    It is only about 4 hours.


    Dave
     
  10. wash

    wash Active Member

    I am not sure I really want to race my street car on big tracks.

    I'm going to sign up for the Horse Thief Mile event in early March but that's a shorter track.

    I think autocross is more my speed. No tire barriers or walls to crash in to and I'm not good at remembering long courses without lots of practice.

    With the roads I drive every day, I think tight and technical is more relevant for me.

    I think that is what the Fiesta ST does best so that reinforces my decision.
     
  11. D1JL

    D1JL Well-Known Member


    It will be great to have you join us on the H T Mile.
    Now I am not trying to change your mind but the good thing about Willow is that there are no tire barriers or walls to run into.
    However as you know, anything can happen.
    The big track only has 9 turns.
    Streets has 12 and HT Mile has 11.


    Dave
     
  12. AlanBDahl

    AlanBDahl Active Member

    I like oversteer since it encourages fast rotation which can come in useful in autocross. My 90 Quattro was set up to be one of the few tail-happy 4WD cars and that worked well for me. I'm also concerned that bigger stickier tires may encourage understeer but given that street tires won't be as sticky as A6s perhaps that won't happen. I'll see how the car handles and if I want a little more rear bias I'll look at the Mazda 2 bar as an option.
     
  13. limbo

    limbo Active Member

    The car feels pretty neutral in stock form with sticky street tires. Not sure id encourage any push. My $.02
     
  14. D1JL

    D1JL Well-Known Member

    What do you conceder stickier?
    Not much out there that is better than OEM.
    I have been looking and found that most anything that is better is a competition only tire.
    The Toyo Proxes offer a treadware of 100 as opposed to 140 of the OEM and still maintain a traction rating of AA.
    I like the Hoosiers for the track, with a treadware of 40 but they have a traction rating of C, heaven help you if you hit any water.


    Dave
     
  15. wash

    wash Active Member

    My first track experience had rain and I was impressed by the amount of grip the stock tires had in wet conditions.

    I was expecting to reduce speed a lot to avoid a spin but the reality was that I still had to push pretty hard to get close to the limit.

    As that point my tires were still very new but its not like they have big rain grooves.

    I've heard that Rivals are good in the dry and not so great in the wet. Luckily I live in California so rain is an infrequent issue and I'll probably try to keep the Rivals mostly dedicated to track duty.
     
  16. limbo

    limbo Active Member

    There are a ton of tires better than oem. Don't let the tw rating fool you.

    Dunlop z2, BFG rival, re-11a, rs-3, to name a few.
     
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  17. D1JL

    D1JL Well-Known Member

    I have done the Dunlops and find the OEMs to be as good if not better.

    I have also done the Toyos and found them to be much better then both.

    As soon as I destroy the set of OEMs I am using the Toyos will the next purchase.


    Dave
     
  18. limbo

    limbo Active Member

    Surprised to hear your results, I have not tried the Toyo's to comment but my experience with the Z2's has been quite the opposite- what type of surface are you running on?
     
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  19. Smokin

    Smokin Active Member


    Whoa.....I see no way the Bridgestone OEMs are even close to the Z IIs in grip. Even if they were the same size...
     
  20. D1JL

    D1JL Well-Known Member

    Opinions are like arsholes everyone has one.
    Mine is based on MY experience of USING these tires and sway bars on a Fiesta not on speculation.

    I find it interesting that people can and do tell me what should and shouldn't work.
    I have or have had this things on MY car, so I HAVE seen what they do first hand.

    The bottom line is that MY car works well for ME.

    As this is just MY opinion, I do, respect, however disagree with yours.


    Dave
     
    Last edited: Feb 12, 2014
    k757 likes this.
  21. AlanBDahl

    AlanBDahl Active Member

    What sort of life do you expect out of the Toyos? What size Toyos do you plan on buying?
     

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