minor annoyance....brakes

Discussion in 'Fiesta ST Sales and Service' started by Deanh, Sep 4, 2014.

  1. Deanh

    Deanh Member

    not sure anyone else has had any issues, but annoying as all get out. 8400 miles on my ST, and my wife drives it most of the time, and she drives like an old lady. Me, ONE spirited drive over Ortega behind a buddies CTSV wagon, and he now has a different opinion of smaller cars. Anyways thats another story. All of a sudden the front brakes ( primarily front right ) started squeeking like crazy, subtle dab of the brakes brings it on, whats subtle inside the car is like a screaming baby outside, reminicent of a badly LOUD squeeking belt. no pulsing of the car so I assume its not warped, tech removed wheel and said some moisture had gotten onto the brake pad ( looked like a tiny piece of rust ) to which I answered HUH?...what if I lived in a rainy state?...and seriously, isnt 8000 miles a tad pre-mature. pads arent worn, but hes replacing frt pads, both sides, and machining the culprit disc....but still, cars not abused, and 8000 miles?....Anyone?...
     
    graynicolas11 likes this.
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  3. McRib 1s Back

    McRib 1s Back Well-Known Member

    You're bound to see/hear some evidence of hard use on any performance brake system. In the case of an otherwise stock FiST, it's the aggressive pad compound -- quite good for a street car!

    While 8K miles doesn't sound much, consider that I've been through two sets of pads in about 2K miles. Many of my miles are on the track, and the wear is pretty even. I understand you're saying it's not just wear. The point here is that mileage alone doesn't tell the story. I'm certain that a FiST driven only for sedate commuting purposes could go a LOT further on a stock set of pads (without noise or issues). You're doing what the car was made for, and now you just have to pay -- a little. Think about your fun runs up and down Ortega!

    Once in a while, you can pick up contaminants or foreign objects. Sometimes the pads or rotors win, sometimes they lose.

    Pad compound matters a lot. My TREG3 TDI is notoriously bad for this. Horrible squealing at low speed that makes everyone look at you. All of the forums talk about this being a VW compound issue, and I believe it is. So, I replaced the rotors and went with upgraded Hawk pads. No more squeaking (and slightly better brake performance).

    Is this being done under warranty? If so, count yourself lucky. These are normal wear items, and a pretty normal problem on a car that is driven spiritedly.
     
  4. Deanh

    Deanh Member

    Appreciate the feed back, my only isuue is theres really ownly been one "Banzai" run in 8000 miles, Im thinking pad material, because we thrashed the snot out of the cars at the Octane academy and not one had any noise issues...anyone here familiar with what they used as their pad material? Im sure it wasnt stock...that said, the damn chirping is driving me NUTS>also, I doubt it will be warranty, brakes etc are wear items, Im just purturbed its an issue at such a low mileage. And I work at a Ford Dealership....
     
  5. WScottCross

    WScottCross Well-Known Member

    I have over 28000 miles on my stock pads and their still fine with no squealing at all. I do a lot of highway driving, but I also drive it hard and autocross it occasionally. 8K does seem pretty early for a commuter that's not driven hard often. Maybe you picked up a pebble or something.
     
    LotusZX3 and Bavarian like this.
  6. Deanh

    Deanh Member

    that was another thought, but disc wasnt scored...very strange.....
     
  7. RodMoe

    RodMoe Well-Known Member

    On a side note I replaced my stock pads for a track weekend with porterfield R4S STREET pads and after the event which was 3) 20 min (6+ laps) sessions on the Full Road America 4.1 mile track and a bit of go kart track autoX the next day about 7) 50 second runs my front pads were in great shape and my calipers where discolored near the tips that ride on the pads. But the REAR PADS were GONE used up 1/8 left on the pass rear and the drivers rear was just a razor thin film left when I changed them out the following monday.. SO was TV working the Rear brakes in the conrers ?? I know these were the wrong pads for the job on that track but it was the newest and best I had on hand with our limited aftermarket as of yet.. I have new cyro treated rotors and they are like new yet so it was funny the rears went away like they did. all in all well worth it and I will do it again this car is that much fun to drive.. Brakes are just the price for having this much fun.. lol YMMV
     
  8. Deanh

    Deanh Member

    judging by how "Mercedes/ BMW" black my front wheels get on a weekly basis< Im guessing the stock pads are relatively soft, which SHOULD go hand in hand with being less likely to Scream like my wife in a 505 off lingerie sale. And absolutely agreed, the cars a hoot, would love to know what the Octane Academy upgraded their pads to....
     
  9. McRib 1s Back

    McRib 1s Back Well-Known Member

    Hey RodMoe, that really does sound like a hyper-active bit with TVC! I've been finding that the more "built" my FiST has become, the more TVC does NOT like it. So, it's out. There's no way your rear pads should be like that! It's also slowing you down! :)

    My R4 (race) pads have been wearing quite well.
     
  10. Steve@Tasca

    Steve@Tasca Fiesta ST Network Sponsor

    Road America is brutal on brakes, not really surprised that you used them up with what you were doing.
     
  11. McRib 1s Back

    McRib 1s Back Well-Known Member

    Front pads, yes. Rear pads, I seriously doubt. Since his front pads were fine, I'm lining up TVC for questioning! :)
     
    jimclark likes this.
  12. reddog99

    reddog99 Active Member

    Think of how much faster you could have gone if the rear brakes hadn't held you back! :)
     
    RodMoe likes this.
  13. McRib 1s Back

    McRib 1s Back Well-Known Member

    For me, it is just a confidence thing. TVC steps in and makes the car go through some pretty unnatural movements. I think this really only affects cars that are more seriously modified. Before my coilovers and aggressive suspension settings, it felt good. Anyhow, I don't want to turn this thread into another TVC thread.

    Back on topic, TVC absolutely contributes to rear brake wear. Our car is probably well north of 60% of the brake force up front. If your rear pad wear is exceeding your front pad wear, there isn't another explanation (for a car that is otherwise running normally).
     
    Bavarian likes this.
  14. Steve@Tasca

    Steve@Tasca Fiesta ST Network Sponsor

    Ever driven Road America?

    The ST has TVC, any stability control? As for rears wearing quicker than fronts I could point at the SVT Focus as a prime example of that, it's actually common on the SVT for the rear pads to wear out quicker than the fronts.

    -Steve
     
  15. McRib 1s Back

    McRib 1s Back Well-Known Member

    Hey Steve, you've reinforced if not proven the point I'm trying to make here.

    This isn't a challenge about unique driving dynamics that exist at Road America, or any race track. This is basic physics at play. Only under "artificial" conditions will rear pads wear faster than fronts on a normal car here on Earth.

    The FoST suffers worse than our FiST, but for the same fundamental reason -- TVC! The FiST is a newer generation of the same system. It works great on the street, but has no place in "racier" applications. At some point you must kill these systems to pursue higher levels of performance.

    Don't get me wrong, plenty of race-minded stability systems make a car faster on the track -- this just isn't one of them.

    I love my FiST, and could probably love a FoST (if I had to!). I'm just trying keep this rooted in good science. Also, I need to ping you to buy some stuff for my FiST! :)
     
  16. RodMoe

    RodMoe Well-Known Member

    LOL I like the rears holding me back..Thats funny stuff right there.. And yes going in to RA I had heard it is a monster on brakes and baby all I can say is that may be a understatement. But I went in to a gun fight with a knife , granted a really sharp knife but still a knife.. live and learn. I do think TV was at work and under braking in a slight downhill curve the car did some odd things like get rear end squirmy or wiggle a little a few times coming into corner 5 under hard braking.. Would not trade any of it for the world what a great venue and fun time in this lil beasty I was So happy with how it did and next time it will have better pads and possibly more umph on the top end.. Plus I won't be a noob so much.. LOVE the CAR and Love the track. FUN FUN FUN ..
     
  17. Deanh

    Deanh Member

    update, fronts done now fine, but in the silence I can hear the rears grinding....the pads are on order for the rears as well....ugh...
     
  18. Steve@Tasca

    Steve@Tasca Fiesta ST Network Sponsor

    I agree about electronic nannies, no real place on track for them in cars like these but I don't think it's down to that alone.

    You seem to have skipped my point about the SVT Focus, some had a rudimentary traction control system that worked on the front only and all had four wheel ABS but pretty much across the board these cars would go through rear brakes much quicker than they did fronts and it had nothing to do with electronics.

    My guess is that because they used a fairly large rear rotor in combination with a pad that has a relatively small contact patch this caused the rear brakes to wear more quickly than the fronts. The 300mm front and 280mm rear brakes on the SVT Focus are incredibly effective but I believe the rear pads are undersized in the grand scheme of things.

    If the Fiesta ST is a similar setup then taking one to a track like Road America where you have to brake heavily from a very high speed several times a lap is most certainly going to burn up those pads much faster.

    Turn 1 and then 5 and 12 in particular absolutely devour brake pads.

    -Steve
     
  19. Steve@Tasca

    Steve@Tasca Fiesta ST Network Sponsor

    Lap times?

    -Steve
     
  20. RodMoe

    RodMoe Well-Known Member

    Best Lap was 2.57.. Most around 3 minutes .. And I know the car was better than the scardy cat driver.. took me a while to stay in the gas in some of the corners ...
     
  21. reddog99

    reddog99 Active Member

    I had to watch that twice! It was fun, even just watching. :)
    I think that Mustang was holding you up.
     
    RodMoe likes this.

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