Rear sway bar, yes or no?

Discussion in 'Fiesta ST Autocross' started by AlanBDahl, May 12, 2014.

  1. Cligedy

    Cligedy Active Member

    I guess what I meant was that one of the ends can be disconnected, not that the bar would be removed completely. I have heard that this is easy to do on some cars.

    Also, I talked with a fellow who is running the Steeda bar. He is very pleased with it. Like all of the rear sway bars for the FiST, the mounting is unconventional, but I think it would be legal. A letter/ email to confirm would be wise before purchasing though. I may ask soon for myself anyway.
     
    Last edited: May 19, 2014
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  3. jasyatz

    jasyatz Member

    So I just got this in my inbox yesterday, seems the Tri Point "rear sway bar" is not a legal item in STF (nor HS/GS as it apllies to this thread) . Although the bar is very good and does what is was designed to do, ( increases rear combined rate under cornering load), it does it in a manner that does not involve a twisting action which is the purpose of a sway bar (more correctly classified as an anti roll bar )... With Doug's permission, I am posting his responses here..


    From: Doug Gill
    Date: May 19, 2014 11:51:42 AM EDT
    To: Jeff Yatsko

    Hi, Jeff,

    It was brought to my attention that I may have given you poor information. I'm following up after I've learned more. I believe I was incorrect in saying that the Tri-Point sway bar is a suspension brace per 14.2.G.3. It looks like it attaches to suspension components and 14.2.G.3 only allows attachment to the chassis.

    I'm so sorry for any errors on my part. I did not mean to be misleading.

    -Doug
    Doug Gill
    SCCA Solo Technical Manager

    The Racing Beat bar (and similar designs) are ALL legal...here's his reply to that effect when asked if a sway bar has to have multiple bends to resemble a "traditional" (anti) sway bar / anti roll bar design...In short..." it's all about the twist". Any design which reduces twist in the rear beam, is legal as a sway bar.

    From: Doug Gill
    Date: May 19, 2014 6:36:25 PM EDT
    To: Jeff Yatsko
    Subject: Rear sway bar clarification

    Non compliant Tri Point Bar

    [​IMG]


    It doesn't necessarily have to have 2 bends to be an anti-roll bar. It has to resist body roll by twisting. The 2 bends create 2 levers to put a twist on the torsion section of that particular anti-roll bar.

    The Racing Beat bar uses the trailing arms of the torsion beam axle to create/limit the twist. The 2nd example uses factory drilled holes to prevent/limit the amount of beam twist

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    This design is not available for the Mazda2/Fiesta but if it were, it would be compliant.
    [​IMG]

    -Doug
    Doug Gill
    SCCA Solo Technical Manager
    1-800-770-2055


    The Tri Point bar comes off today, maybe I can make a camera bar out of it..any body want it to try it out? it can give you toe control under load, and can also be used to adjust toe in and toe out if you'd like...pm for more details to avoid thread clutter.

    Jeff
     
    Last edited: May 20, 2014
    Cligedy likes this.
  4. Mightymango

    Mightymango Active Member

    So I guess I'm confused by that as I'm not seeing the reference pictures.
     
  5. jasyatz

    jasyatz Member

    I didn't originally include one, but I updated the post to include some visual references. I've been made aware that there are other Rear Torsion bar/sway bar manufacturers out there for the Fiesta, post up pictures of them and I'll make sure and check with Doug n compliance. Or you can....He's been very helpful throughout the process.
     
    Last edited: May 20, 2014
  6. Cligedy

    Cligedy Active Member

    This is the Steeda bar. I just pulled these from a Google image search. It looks like the installation pic is from D1JL, who's name I recognize from the forums. I don't remember if he ever gave a review/ impressions. [​IMG][​IMG]
     
  7. Mightymango

    Mightymango Active Member

    The last picture you posted (not the Steeda one) is what the Eibach one looks like. So that is good to know that will be considered legal.
     
  8. limbo

    limbo Active Member

    So the Eibach is legal, the Steeda is not? I'm not convinced the Eibach did much of anything
     
  9. jasyatz

    jasyatz Member

    Both are legal according to Doug. As long as it acts on the beam, provides resistance using a twisting motion and is forward of the hub centerline in the torsional action, it is legal.
     
  10. raamaudio

    raamaudio Active Member

    I have this from the 332ti project I am parting out. A little tweaking and fab up some mounts....I need to look into the stiffness of it but do not want massive bar, I can shorten the arms to make it stiffer if need be quite easily, etc.....

    I might be able to flip it, I will put the exhaust back on later today and take a look.

    It is a ground control for E36 and I have all the parts, hollow tube, etc.....their medium bar and I can make it stiffer by shortening the arms if needed.

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: May 21, 2014
  11. Couldahadav8

    Couldahadav8 Active Member

    Will the swaybar cause more tripodding?


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  12. raamaudio

    raamaudio Active Member

    It might but that is not a huge issue if it makes other things better but testing is the only way to find out on such a new platform.
     
  13. Mightymango

    Mightymango Active Member

    I haven't noticed more but I have had 0 rubbing issues with the 225/45/16 ZII set up.
     
  14. AlanBDahl

    AlanBDahl Active Member

    What does it take to install the Eibach bar? Can I do it in my driveway with a single floor jack and hand tools? Do you install it with weight on the wheels or not?
     
  15. Mightymango

    Mightymango Active Member

    I installed it with the wheels on. I did it on a hoist at first but I did it with two jacks later as you need one to support the suspension when you unbolt the rear shock.
     
  16. AlanBDahl

    AlanBDahl Active Member

    Would it be possible to do the install just sitting on a pair of ramps?
     
  17. Mightymango

    Mightymango Active Member

    Only if you can support the suspension so you can put it back together.

    What I did is jacked up one side of the car, put a jack under the twist beam to support it. Unbolted the shock and mounted the bar on the one side. Then I jacked up the twist beam to the shock and bolted the shock back into place. Then I repeated on the other side.

    Ramps would work as you could then use the jack on the twist beam as long as it reaches.
     
  18. AlanBDahl

    AlanBDahl Active Member

    I've been thinking of getting one of those aluminum jacks, maybe this is a good excuse to buy one? :) Thanks for the advice!
     
  19. Couldahadav8

    Couldahadav8 Active Member

    What offset wheels are you guys running with the 225/45/16s?


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  20. Mightymango

    Mightymango Active Member

    42 is my offset.

    The problem is that the ZII is discontinued so my options for a replacement are REALLY limited in that size now.

    Alan : I used harbor freight to get a jack, I have needed one for swapping tires and sway bar adjustments on the evo.
     
  21. Couldahadav8

    Couldahadav8 Active Member

    Thanks.


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