Still no track pads for the FiST? WTF people!

Discussion in 'Fiesta ST Chassis Upgrades' started by CrookedRacer, Nov 28, 2014.

  1. CrookedRacer

    CrookedRacer Active Member

    Thanks GolfGuy! This is just goodness all around. I'm digging the more doing. We need more doing like this.
     
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  3. TRev

    TRev Member

    FYI, the new Hawk Street Race pads are pretty aggressive on OEM rotors.
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Jan 31, 2015
    CrookedRacer likes this.
  4. Mightymango

    Mightymango Active Member

    Aggressive to the point of needing different rotors? (your picture link is broken)
     
    CrookedRacer likes this.
  5. TRev

    TRev Member

    No, as in one set of pads will equal one set of rotors from what I can tell. I do like the feel of these pads more than any other from what driving I have done thus far. No noise and get progressively aggressive as they heat up but excellent bite cold too.

    Thanks for letting me know about the pic. I was using my Google Drive for the first time and set the pic to public. The URL didn't look right for the forum but I was able to see the pic on my end so thought it was alright.
     
    Last edited: Jan 31, 2015
  6. CrookedRacer

    CrookedRacer Active Member

    I guess I better get a couple more, then!

    [​IMG]
    Motorcraft BRRF206 Brake Rotor Assembly
    by Motorcraft
    Link: http://amzn.com/B00J5DTH0W
     
  7. Mightymango

    Mightymango Active Member

    Picture works now. I was planning on replacing the rotors with the pads anyway. They are cheap enough.
     
  8. AlanBDahl

    AlanBDahl Active Member

    FWIW my rotors need to be replaced after 26k miles with the stock pads. I autocross about a dozen times a year so that may have accelerated the wear somewhat however.
     
  9. TRev

    TRev Member

    Good to know. Sounds like the FiST rotors maybe wear easy. My FoST has 22k miles and the rotors look good after 25+ events with the HPS pads.
     
  10. Did you make 26K miles on the stock pads? I suspect my usage will be closer to yours (good bit of autocross, but no road course, easy daily driver) than someone who does a lot of road course time on it :)
     
  11. AlanBDahl

    AlanBDahl Active Member

    Yes after 26k my front pads are down to 3mm and the rears are at 4mm. Since I was looking at upgrading to better pads with less dust it's not a big deal except for the need to replace the front rotors which I was not expecting.
     
  12. TRev

    TRev Member

    I think my wear has much to do with the snow and ice covered roads here in combination with the aggressive pads. The e-diff is working constantly and I believe that is contributing to wear on my rotors which have under 700 miles. First winter I have had a vehicle with an e-diff but makes sense in theory.
     
  13. CrookedRacer

    CrookedRacer Active Member

    I bought a set of Street Race and a set of DTC-60 pads.

    I installed the Street Race on Monday night, "bedded them in" according to Hawk procedure, and drove them to work and back for three days.

    Yesterday I took them apart again to check on them before I head out for this year's first track weekend tomorrow.

    They had worn unevenly, and I realized it was because Hawk had supplied four OUTER pads. The little nubs on the face of the pad backer are all in the same place (closer together). The nubs are right where the caliper piston hits the pad, so it only pushes on the inner radial edge of the pads on the inner pad. I just figured Hawk knows best, the nubs would align inside the caliper pistons, and I didn't realize that the inner pads were being canted by the nubs when I installed them.

    I opened the DTC-60 pads and they sent me four OUTER pads for those, too!

    Has this happened to anyone else? I would think it MUST have happened to other folks, since it happened to me on two different compounds.

    I went ahead and ground down the nubs on two of them to "convert" them to INNER pads and reinstalled them on some fresh rotors, since I need pads for this weekend. But if my old rotors didn't need turning before, they do now.

    I'm waiting for Hawk technical support to get back with me, but the guy is out sick today. I just wouldn't want other people to end up going home early if this ends up being a common issue.
     
  14. CrookedRacer

    CrookedRacer Active Member

    T
    That's about what mine look like after just a day. We'll see what kind of life we get out of the rotors. Hopefully it's just the bedding in, and the overall wear rate isn't so bad.
     
  15. TRev

    TRev Member

    I had shop put them in and they didn't say anything about any install issues. Wondering if they will fit and have issues or if they won't even fit without modification?
     
  16. CrookedRacer

    CrookedRacer Active Member

    They're easy to install without modifying them. And that would result in installing them in a way that the inner pads aren't quite flat.

    It's something that could very easily go unnoticed, too (even by a shop), because normally when you install pads, they can flop around a little as you place them in their slots or whatever, and you assume that when you get them on the rotor, they'll be flat.

    You won't see the really uneven wear until you take them back off and see the back surface of the rotors have only worn heavily on a ring closest to the hub.

    You might want to take a look at yours. All you need is a 15mm wrench to unbolt the caliper from the knuckle, and a piece of wire to hang your caliper out of the way.

    It's difficult to see without removing the rotor, because the splash shield pretty effectively hides the whole INNER surfaces of the rotors.

    The other thing to mention is that the Hawk pads (both compounds) don't say INNER or OUTER like the OEM pads do. They don't say anything. Which is another reason why I believed they would be interchangeable.
     
  17. TRev

    TRev Member

    Thanks for the info CrookedRacer! I will try to take a look at them soon. I swapped rims tonight and the rotor wear is definitely still happening. I didn't notice the brake dust because of the steelies. When taking them off they were literally caked with dust and my car only has 1400 miles on it. I went for a 10 mile drive and wheels were noticeably covered. I like the driving characteristics of the pad but at this point, I have to say that I don't recommend it based on what I am seeing with regard to rotor wear and dusting (worst I have ever seen by far) not to mention CrookedRacer's inner/outer problem he found.
     
  18. TRev

    TRev Member

    The inside of the wheel is literally painted with layers of break dust.
    [​IMG]

    The rotor wear continues and is a couple of mm deep.
    [​IMG]

    I plan to give Hawk a call to discuss.
     
  19. CrookedRacer

    CrookedRacer Active Member

    Here are what all the pads look like.

    To the left, clearly marked INNER and OUTER, are the OEM pads. The center pads are the STREET RACE pads. To the right are the DTC-60 race compound pads.

    ALL FOUR of the pads provided in each Hawk set looked identical. It's not like they were all marked OUTER. There is no marking to say whether it's inner or outer or both.

    My wheels, in just three days of commuting this week, with the pads improperly positioned, were completely dark from the brake dust. Probably because it was coming off way faster than designed, likely due to the very small contact patch on at least the inner pad.

    [​IMG]

    Below is how I modified them in preparation for tomorrow's track day at Summit Point:

    [​IMG]

    They'll sit flat now. I ground them in a radial direction so there would be minimal area where the caliper piston has no contact with the pad backing.

    The DTC-60 came with no anti-squeal plates on them.

    Trev, I can't wait to see what your pads look like and whether you also got a complete set of left shoes.
     
  20. CrookedRacer

    CrookedRacer Active Member

    So I just completed a weekend at Summit Point Main Circuit with SCCA PDX. I ran in the Intermediate group, and I had a ball. Saturday was rainy, and Sunday was delightful. I learned a lot on both days.

    My modified STREET-RACE pads (see above) performed pretty well over the weekend, but they're all but used up now. They have about 3/32nds of pad material left. That's two days, with just nine sessions lasting no longer than 20 minutes each. A couple were much shorter due to other car offs on the track. I'm disappointed that the pads didn't wear better than they did.

    Speaking of which, they wore rather unevenly on the rotor, too. They look like Trev's rotors pictured above, but worse. Some of the instructors were saying it was generally unacceptable that they'd wear like that. They'd never seen grooves so deep without the pads actually getting down to metal.

    On Sunday morning after the first day of sessions, I pulled the rotors off to inspect them before my first Sunday session. I wanted to be sure the inner pads were wearing evenly across the pad, and that they were wearing at about the same rate as the outer pads. They were indeed wearing properly, albeit scored pretty badly just like the outer ones.

    On Sunday afternoon, after the sun came out, the temperature climbed all the way to 50 degrees. And my pads started to fade late in the sessions. So I could definitely use some kind of additional cooling. My once-red calipers (my second set so far) are now rather brown and bubbly in places.

    This coming weekend, I'll be running the DTC-60's on virgin rotors at Virginia International Raceway. We'll see what a ridiculously expensive, dedicated track pad can do. I'll also see if I can cobble my brake ducts by then. I hope that also makes a real difference.

    I still have a call in to Hawk. I doubt I'll hear from them before Wednesday, since the one tech support guy "Edwin" was sick on friday and is on travel today and tomorrow.

    Pics of the rotor aftermath to come.
     
    KKaWing likes this.
  21. Mightymango

    Mightymango Active Member

    Did you hear anything? Now I am debating swapping the pads out at all if they aren't going to fit right. I haven't opened my box but hearing what you guys are finding...I'm guessing I am going to find the same issue.
     

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